According to The World Cam Parry’s word salad Tuesday where he tossed around the words “ordinance”, “ballot”, “November” and “referendum” like confetti, confused not only the paper but fellow interim commissioner, Fred Messerle. Messerle was heard during the meeting saying he didn’t want to put a governance change to a vote of the people but he still supported Parry drafting an ordinance, or possible ballot title, its hard to tell because probably Parry didn’t know what he meant either.
Now it looks like both Bob Main and Messerle will object to putting this to a vote of the people. Main objected to placing the matter on the ballot unless also including other proposed governance changes like the new county charter. Messerle objects because he believes it is a management decision that does not require nor should be held up by a public vote.
A copy of the video is heading my way and I will produce those clips from previous meetings as well as Tuesday’s meeting, Coos County’s own Larry, Curly and Moe, as soon as possible.
Mark – you want to know why the private sector is sitting on $3 trillion dollars? Because business doesn’t trust this administration as far as we could throw them. Debt has skyrocketed. Greece has $447 Billion dollars worth of debt, and its collapse could bring down global markets. $447B – that’s less than 3% of the Federal government’s debt and that tiny country is threatening to bring down global markets and explode in civil chaos. Business people know that if this administration gets re-elected, they’re going to deliver a massive tab to each of us. I’m wondering how you came to the conclusion that the housing market is “improving”? Maybe it’s improving for the folks in a position to buy, but I doubt the folks who are selling for pennies on the dollar would agree with you. There’s really no upside if home sales improve at the same time sale prices are collapsing. And seriously – you believe government can fill “demand”? With whose money? As an economics major, Mark, I prefer to not be creative about such serious matters. I rely on facts and data. I don’t watch any of the so-called news channels – I read. If you want to have that coffee one day I’ll be happy to bury you with the economic evidence that proves there is a big difference between political and party-loyal media spin and reality.
Please watch something besides fox news Al. That’s right the president has sent a jobs bill to congress that the house speaker will not bring to the floor. You referred to the stimulus package. Apples and oranges Al. Don’t get the wrong idea and think I’m for the the Dems, that party is as corrupt as the republicans. I have never been a party member and from the example of representation we have in our district I would never join either of them. The economy has been stalled by the republicans just to bring down Obama, and that has no doubt, hurt your harley business as it has hurt most business owners across the board. I blame the republicans for stalling our economy and the dems for letting them do it. that is exactly why we need a viable third party, to make the twins act responsible or lose their party members to an alternative. Both sides can squarely share the blame for the state of our economy. If we get Romney and things stay as they have been since GWB, then a new party may rise from the ashes. Time will tell. I believe your doing all you can to weather this downturn and I hope you and the other business owners in town survive. I’ve owned two harleys in the past and may want another one someday. It would be a shame to have to go to a larger city to buy one.
Oh, al, c’mon. You can’t have your own facts.
Bernanke’s warning was to NOT repeat the mistakes of the Rep Party that cost the US its AAA credit rating.
The private sector has had steady growth since Feb 2010. It’s the PUBLIC sector that has suffered job losses — precisely because of the austerity measures that Reps champion. As John Boehner infamously said, “So be it.” Obama was not wrong when he said, “The private sector is doing fine.” Assuredly so, as it is sitting on 3 TRILLION investment dollars, as you point out. What is the private sector waiting for? Give me 3 trillion dollars to invest and I’ll create thousands of jobs tomorrow. I only need to look at Ronald Reagan for a blueprint.
The economy may be slowing, but it is still growing. Housing is picking up too. I could easily argue that this shows austerity does not work. Europe is exhibit #1. Consider: Lending rates are so low currently that the US can borrow money at a NEGATIVE rate to build bridges, schools, rail, and so on. Why would we NOT want to do that? (. . . because it might make Obama and the Dems look good, maybe?)
Demand is missing link. Government needs to fill that void. According to the Humphrey-Hawkins Full Employment Act of 1978, it is the lawful obligation of government to put EVERYBODY to work when the private cannot do so. Whadda say we enforce the law? We could use some new bridges, schools, and rail, no?
One better: I could persuade the private sector to invest that $3 trillion tomorrow. How? Enact an Eisenhower tax rate of 90% on earned income over $4 million/year or on stagnant capital. Just watch the growth of new business and investment the day after that law goes into effect.
You’re a smart guy. You know this is true. Have you seen the recent Economist magazine? It’s right there on the front cover.
Let’s not make up our own realities.
Jobs bill? What jobs? Where? Solyndra? Are you reading the Wall St. Journal? Did you listen to Bernanke’s speech yesterday? Are you aware of how many jobs the private sector has lost in the last four years? Are you aware the economy is slowing again? How’s all that housing inventory the banks are holding coming along? Or, how about the $3 trillion dollars of derivitive exposure the top ten U.S. banks are holding? Just wondering…
Hey Al be sure to thank the speaker as well for helping Obama with his jobs bill, oh I forgot he didn’t help with that did he.
Ricky – Yes, Curry has a balanced budget, but let’s review how they got there: Animal Control was transitioned to a private non-profit. Human Services and Public Health are planning to transition from the County sometime during FY 2012/2013. The Sheriff’s department is a skeleton and John Bishop has informed the county that the jail will close next June (end of FY) for lack of funding. The BOC will not contribute to the PERS reserve fund this year for lack of money. They pillaged $350,000 from the Vehicle Replacement Fund and the General Fund Sheriff’s Road Patrol is budgeted to receive $700,000 from the Road Capital Improvement Fund – shoring up one department at the expense of another.
I don’t think anyone could argue that the patient is doing a slow death with no cure in site. And before folks begin rallying around the call for higher property taxes, bear in mind that over 12% of Curry citizens over the age of 60 are below the poverty line and Curry County is 8-9% below Oregon in median income, while Oregon is 9% below the national average. Lane, Douglas and Josephine are dealing with the same issues and it is only a matter of time – barring a miraculous economic rebound – before Coos faces the same challenges.
I have to sign off now. I have to write a thank-you letter to Biden and Obama, thanking them for their significant contribution in making my little business such a huge success.
One more time, for Little al:
Does that “fiscal responsibility” you speak of include businessmen like you who suck from the Public Tit, then turn around and tell those of us who weaned ourselves from Mama’s Breast decades ago, that Mama is empty? Was it “fiscally responsible” for the county to give you twenty thousand dollars of Other People’s Money for your private cycle business al?
You speak so eloquently about the county being broke, just like Barton and Messerlie, all the while sucking all you can from the taxpayers? For jobs that never come, for industry that never pays it’s own way?
“I’m against government hand-outs, especially when the recipients aren’t contributing anything and the taxpayers don’t get anything in return for that money.” Little al.
I’ve been out of the loop, just spent some time reading. Seems Little al, is getting the whipping he deserves. This quote by this man is stunning. Which is it, absolutely no sense of shame, or really incapable of even the slightest critical thinking? I am amazed to see him post this, knowing what a free–loading hypocrite the man is, my opinion only,he probably reads this and smiles, thinking to himself, “tee hee, I took their money, I’m a very successful businessman, and they aren’t, he he.” You’re no different than the next two bit poser Little al.
Closing BHDS was the goal, so waste connection could get the job of handling the county’s garbage. It was one of the goals that the interim bosses made a priority. There was never a serious effort to look into repairs. They got their “expert” to condemn the facility, and never looked back. One “favor” completed by Messerle, Barton, and Parry. After the election is over, the next set of goals will begin. They will next privatize all the county’s road work to Knife River. So expect lots of layoffs in the road dept. They will outsource as much county business as possible. The SCDC gang have plans to make our government into a profit making machine for their exclusive membership, that’s why they want a admin set up to have one person they select who will direct county dollars into the right hands.They know that a profit can be made at the tax payers expense. We will all be paying taxes to a system that has been arranged for maximum profit to a few individuals. The model their using is exactly like the system the port is using, an admin who directs the flow of tax dollars to a few special people. They have no other reason to do this. There are a lot of Jeff Bishop types out there ready to do what their told to do by SCDC. Jon Barton already has his list of candidates for this position, and it won’t be the locals who are hoping to get the job, it will be someone from outside the area who can easily leave this area when they get to much heat for handing out no-bid contracts with non-disclosure agreements to the friends of SCDC, just like the port has been doing..And when they want or need more profit they will find a way to raise our property taxes to get it. The die is cast because most of the candidates running for these commissioner jobs are on board with their plan to hire an admin. The peoples government should not be used for or by profiteers, The county government should provide services to its citizens at cost, not cost plus 25%-50% profit. Were being hijacked and robbed in slow motion by this group Bob Main opened the door for.
Re Mr. Al’s concern about the solid waste department of which I may be the only Coos County citizen to acknowledfe that I know absolutley nothing. Al, or MAGIX, you are close to the county pulse – Al’s close pal is chairman of the board of commissioners. WHY haven’t people been fired? The county hired alleged experts to run the solid waste department – and Mr. Sanne was never a leader and never claimed to be an expert. The county commissioners who are not experts in solid waste and much more county management related, relied on these people. Did these people, at any level, identify and make actual and potential harzards known to the commissioners? If so, when? Did they sound the alarm in writing? If so, make it public. What was the response by department managers or commssioners to their concerns? Why haven’t department leaders been called before the board of commssioners in an public forum to tell their employers, the citizens of Coos County, what went so terribly wrong.
A better question is what proof is there that a single administrator would have overseen maintenance at BHDS any better? It is rich really, that Al and company worked so hard to turn BHDS over to Waste Connections and can now, without conscience, use their success as a weapon to further their gains…. Disgusting
All this angst about an Administrator. It seems everyone has forgotten about that multi-million dollar Solid Waste facility loss. The question that needs to be answered is HOW did no less than seven or eight Commissioners let it get to that state in spite of the warnings from management, and WHY did they NOT take action?
I’m guessing it was because no one was in charge. No one managed the situation, no one prioritized the situation. I.E. – the county didn’t have a boss making the right decisions. Even if Mr. Kirby is right in his estimates (which I highly doubt), $600k pales in comparison to what the tax payers lost out at Solid Waste.
Do not be fooled by red herrings, this is pure political calculation of Freds part. I about laughed myself silly when he voted for the ballot measure thereby ensuring a Main victory in November.
See, the people who want an administrator will vote for fred, but the ones who dont will vote for Main. The ones who do want one are going to vote (likely voters) anyway, while the ones who dont are more likely to stay home absent this issue. They will tend to be elderly, long time residents who just want to be left alone, and if left alone will not get to involved in the political process. Putting the C. A. on the ballot will energize these voters moving them from “unlikely” to vote into the “likely” category, and they will vote almost exclusively for Main.
Freds flop, doesnt hurt him at the polls as his voters would prefer an executive action over a vote anyway, and if postponed until after the election may not energize the “silent majority”. The question is if Main can keep the heat on Fred, and keep the “silent majority” energized until the fall.
I would have loved to be in the room when they figured this out. Self inflicted wounds are the ones that do the most damage in elections.
Mr. Wiley,speaking of Jackson County, often dicussion here turns to SCDC or the damn Republicans – I used to be one. If interested in what SCDC could and should be, try soredi.org. Copy of letter en route to your e-mail address appearing on your candidate filing papers.
Mr. Wiley, the often used Al example of Jackson County has 34 people reporting to their county administrator. That’s misleading. In fact, the manager has five direct assistants helping him mange the county with department heads reporting to the six. The annual expense for the six (salary, PERS, perks, offices expenses, travel and all else is about $700,000, according to one of the assistants, in writing. There is a very detailed section in the county budget at the county web site that discusses county government. I recall that the entire document is about 500 pages. The manager is making about $200,000 in salary alone. And, according to the citizens, he is worth it. No assurance that we would get a comparable quality manager. The assitant manager recently departed to be the city manager of Ashland. He may or may not have been replaced. Jackson is not a timber based economy. It’s also about twice the size of Coos County.
The audio on Tuesday’s video is poor requiring me to build transcriptions into the clips or I would have posted video by now showing how spurious the gov and struct arguments for an administrator really are. Maybe today or tomorrow I will be done but Fred and Cam’s explanation of the types of “policy” they need to be freed up to “legislate” will be worth the wait.
Remenber When Al kept saying that Curry was just a couple months from bankruptcy guess what they have a balanced budget for the fiscal year 2012=2013. Yes it used the reserves up but they are still open for bussiness. Agin I want to thank the wisdom of past commissiners to create the resevere fund that we have. This fund is added to everytime we sell timber. I have a question to Al how much property taxes do the big timber land owners pay? Isnt thier rate less than the citezens of Coos County? and finally How much does it cost counties with a manager for thier department? People look at Lane they have a manger, and thier finaical position is very poor. They laid off road deputies,and reduced the jail capacity to less than 100. Im asking everyone that can make it to this mornings meeting come and let the commissioners know how you feel about this issue. sign up for public comments. Its time for the voters voice to be heard. If we remain silent than shame on us
Yea Al’s real big on telling us how broke Curry county is, hoping it lends credence to the idea an administrator will solve coos county’s ills. His buddies at SCDC and the chamber have rewarded him for his loyalty to their schemes. He took tax dollars for his personal gain and wants everyone else to look the other way. If you call him on his payoff he will just call you a fool. What a weasel. Did Jon promise you a seat on one of his committees for your loyalty, that won’t sell harleys will it. I think Al has his eye on how well Jon’s doing bilking public dollars and wants to move into a slot beside Jon to get some of that easy money. Why else would he carry water for that tax sucking organisation.
Is that just the republican way nationally or is this just happening in Coos County?
You can call me a fool, but that won’t change what you are trying to do to this county. You guys are setting up this new system just to carve up the county’s resources, and if you truly don’t see what Jon and Fred are trying to do then the fool is looking at you in the mirror, but your in on the scheme all the way. When your group gets it done and things don’t improve for anyone but your gang then you guys will have an expendable scapegoat to blame, send him down the road with a golden parachute and get another patsy to help keep your system of bilking the public going. You guys might get away with this two maybe three time before the public gets wise and sends you and your bunch running for the hills. If the truth could be know, I would bet Jon hand picks the new admin and the one after that. He’s using your sorry ass as a cheerleader for SCDC, and you think your using him as a stepping stone. Its all pretty transparent and I’m not the only one that can see what your up to.
My bad. Thought Al had more in him than that.
Not enough time to put your spin together Al ?
This ought to be good one.
Do your own homework for a change, Reminder.
Or, simply continue playing the fool. Your choice.
The only difference I can see between these republicans who want free money only for themselves, and these progressive democrats who pander to big money, is how you spell their names.
Al says,” perhaps you can figure out CB’s UR funding, how they get that money, and the implications for each business that utilizes those funds.”
Educate us Al. Who exactly approved your free handout? If you give us the names of who approved it, then we can see if their connected to SCDC. What are the implications for a Harley Dealer that utilizes those funds? How are the tax payers rewarded for giving you free money?
Al say’s “I’m against government hand-outs, especially when the recipients aren’t contributing anything and the taxpayers don’t get anything in return for that money.”
What are the taxpayers getting in return for your grant?
Al you want to believe the UR funds have no connection to SCDC go ahead., but we’ve seen the county Commissioners approve the funding for UR for the towns to be able to get those monies, before the towns can hand it out. The Commissioners are SCDC, and the people who granted your free hand out are either connected to SCDC or the Chamber(SCDC). We all know who approves these things,and we’ve seen you hawk for SCDC. Its not hard to connect the dots Al. Give your handout back them maybe you won’t look so tainted.
Al, regarding your comment addressed to me, I am a supporter of hiring an administrator to oversee organization operations (a COO) and then permitting the commissioners time to manage and grow this county (co- CEO’s) (one Chairman). Period. I am not an advocate of creating another feifdom. How cound any person who has been on the executive payroll of any large private or public organization or a person having been the head of a well managed government body not be? But, this is Coos County, not a business along Sand Hill, nor Mathilda, nor the El Camino. Millions of angels monies are not moved around on lunch tables. This is struggling fiscally, timber payments dependent, Coos County, in the boonies.
To help sell your aguments, please address or convince me and others that:
first, after hiring an administrator to do their job, the three commissioners will continue to be working full time for full time pay;
second, what will the commissioners be doing that they don’t do now or not doing that they do now (where’s the charter change for the people’s consideration);
third, assuming that the commissioners continue to be paid full time pay for full time work, that there are monies (and where will they come from) to hire an administrator (recruiting, salary, PERS, perks, golden parachute) (assuer us that public safety will not be affected by changes to the budget);
fourth,that no staff is required nor will any staff be hired to support an administrator (we both know the fellow can’t work successfully in a vacuum):
fifth, that a single administrator can oversee 24 different departments (alone) while taking time to improve each department. And, that while having less than 3/4 day each month to manage each department, the administrator will be able to anticipate hazards to the county and remedy all unanticipated problems encountered and assure us that the three commissioners will NOT get involved in day to day county departments operations;
sixth; that the citizens will have acccess to the adminsitrator at all resonable times;
seventh; that the county department heads will report to one master, not four or more;
eighth; that the administrator hired will be a seasoned professional with at least 10 years verifiable experience successfully managing a timber payments driven COUNTY government, who has never been terminated or has never been encouraged to leave a similar position, who has managed a county with demography, assets, and problems similar to Coos County;
ninth; that construction of offices are not required for an administrator and staff (there is nowhere in that court house for new organizations or peoples and you certainly would not stick the administrator remote from the employees;
tenth; that (self claimed) overworked Ms. Brooks can support three commissioners and an adnministrator. Al, you know that without administrator staff the lady will be working 24/7 for the admisnitrator – somebody will be needed to support the commissioners.
eleventh; there is money for a special election if Mr. Parry’s motion stands and five commissioners are to be elected. I presume that Mr. Parry will soon make a motion to undo what he has done.
Al, you and I can afford a tax increase to pay for your wish list – most of our neigbors can’t. Please, you have argued unsuccessfuly that the county is is dire fiscal straits. Where in the current budget will the needed monies be coming from? Thanks.
Rick – it would be a bargain for the Federal government to trade those timber payments for property taxes. The states receiving timber subsidies all these years basically won the lottery under the Clinton administration – at the taxpayer’s expense. It’s disingenous to claim that local property owners aren’t paying “their fair share” when they’ve been paying for these subsidies through federal taxes for decades. Had the counties and states adjusted their budgets thirty years ago to match reality they wouldn’t be in the shape they’re in. Yes, Coos County is in better shape – today – but Coos County is burning more cash than they’re taking in, so the writing is on the wall. It’s only a matter of when the the lines cross.
And Reminder – linking CB’s UR fund with SCDC is one of the most absurd comments I’ve read here. Let’s take it a step further and blame SCDC for the Denver fires. You are right about one thing: I’m against government hand-outs, especially when the recipients aren’t contributing anything and the taxpayers don’t get anything in return for that money. If you and Themguys put your heads together, perhaps you can figure out CB’s UR funding, how they get that money, and the implications for each business that utilizes those funds. In the words of Milton Friedman: there’s no such thing as a free lunch.
Should those free urban renewal fund dollars go to every business in town, or just those that are willing to shill for SCDC goals. Line up and get your tax money back is what Al is promoting. No favoritism going on in Coos County,this is just tax returns being re-routed by another government program. I thought he was a republican, they are supposed to be against government hand outs, maybe that just means everyone else is not supposed to get the free handouts. We see how the favors are re-paid, no matter how you want to spin the story.
Al Coos County is in better shape then Lane, Because of the past commissioners building up reserves from timber sales. Itsnt this a great bussiness practice? They did this with our current structure. If all land owners paid thier fair share of property taxes we would be in better shape. Last when will the county send the federal goverment thier property tax bill?
Dear Themguys: your crude and intellectually wanting “public tit” reference is probably towards the City of Coos Bay’s Urban Renewal Fund. The twenty thousand that you state is an interesting number. Pray tell – where, exactly, did you get such a number? I suspect you made that one up. And the City’s budget is not related to the County’s. Your insinuation that I am somehow stealing my own money – or someone else’s – tells me you should read up on the subject. (When I find a way to draw more tax money out than I put in, THEN you can call it stealing. But I’m a looong way from that scenario.)
Rick: it would be very easy for me to conclude that Lane County would be in worse shape than it is if they were still trying to manage their waning dollars with the same failing structure that we have. Good management practice should be exercised at all times – especially in tough times.
And Mr. Kirby: $600k for an Administrator is a good story if you’re against hiring one, but your numbers aren’t realistic. I suspect that an Administrator will get a small office like everyone else, be supported by Bobbi like everyone else, and will immediately get on with the job of streamlining the organization and saving the County money.
I can’t add on early Sunday mornings. It’s almost $600,000 next year not $400,000.
Al, I’ll bet you and the other PAC members were furious when you heard that Messerle had voted to hire commissioners at zero salary. Destroys your dream team. If Messerle soon makes a motion to undo his offically recorded damage motion and vote, I hope Parry comes to his rescue and tells us why his motion that he believes so stiongly about must now be reversed. if the commissioners add to the $300,000/year for three commissioners as Messerle now apparenly wants, two additional commissioners as now advocated by your friend Parry, an adminitrstor with an annual salary and PERS at a modest $200,000, a staff of only one at $60,000 salary and PERS, office construction of $75,000, a special election to add two commissioners at $60,000, thats almost $400,000 next year that must come from somewhere. Will it come from budgeted jail expenses and the bad guys will be going free?
Al isnt Lane county a county with a administrator. How well is that doing for them. As you said they just released inmates. From what I can tell Coos County is in better fiscal shape than Lane with our existing form of goverment.
FACTS ARE FACTS
al
July 14, 2012 – 4:38 pm
What is, exactly, the difference between a business and a government? To the contrary, nothing but good can come from government exercising more fiscal responsibility, out-sourcing where possible, and delivering ROI that is befitting today’s economy.”
Does that “fiscal responsibility” you speak of include businessmen like you who suck from the Public Tit, then turn around and tell those of us who weaned ourselves from Mama’s Breast decades ago, that Mama is empty? Was it “fiscally responsible” for the county to give you twenty thousand dollars of Other People’s Money for your private cycle business al?
You speak so eloquently about the county being broke, just like Barton and Messerlie, all the while sucking all you can from the taxpayers? For jobs that never come, for industry that never pays it’s own way?
What is, exactly, the difference between a business and a government? To the contrary, nothing but good can come from government exercising more fiscal responsibility, out-sourcing where possible, and delivering ROI that is befitting today’s economy. It’s a new world and change is inevitable. We can either get ahead of the curve or have it forced upon us like Lane, Douglas, Curry, Josephine and others. Lane County releasing 30 felons onto the public for lack of funding is representative of a government that is seriously broken. And severe problems such as these require extreme measures and significant change.
“his way?” is right Mouse, these people have been behind the stagnation of this county for decades. And they point their fingers at ANYone trying to bring to light who is behind this stagnation. All the Wednesday meetings in the world ain’t goinna change the fact that Coos County is the butt joke of Oregon. I didn’t cause that, Magix didn’t cause that , Phil didn’t cause that, Wim didn’t cause that, but boy howdy, look at the finger pointing going on about WHO is causing the blocking of a vibrant economy for this county. It aiin’t Barton, It ain’t Pettit, it ain’t SCDC, it ain’t the three Messerles pulling down a couple hundred thousand each and every year, it ain’t Bennetti, well then who the hell IS responsible for the last forty years? They all claim THEY are. So let’s blame them at every opportunity. But you always have the ignorant local business guy bragging about how he “GOT” to fill some potholes for the Port of Coos Bay. At half a billion dollars down the Port Hole, that’s some expensive part time job !!!!
Well, selected (but not Elected) commissioner Messerle has now made it clear that he has no intention of paying any attention to anything the public thinks as he runs Coos County his way.
Even after a year as a commissioner, Messerle still doesn’t understand the difference between a business and a government by and for the people. He is wholly unsuited for a government job
The worldlink makes it appear that Messerle has dropped the idea of an administrator, but He just opposes the public getting a vote on the issue. He and his gang from SCDC just plan to pass it with their votes only. He has no intention of letting the public have a say in this by allowing a vote. That might piss his co-conspirator Jon Barton off.
WTF? Messerle sure has a problem with the public – and doesn’t understand how government works. I foresee expensive litigation that the county surely can’t afford (aren’t we broke or something?)
Idiots are dangerous when they have power….stolen or not.